Putting a "random" encounter that didn't exist five minutes earlier in the path of your players, knowing it will be a TPK, is the DM version of murder hobo-ing. You're ignoring the logic of the game and the feelings of the other players so you can have fun killing things. You're not fixing the problem, you're becoming part of it.

Putting a "random" encounter that didn't exist five minutes earlier in the path of your players, knowing it will be a TPK, is the DM version of murder hobo-ing. You're ignoring the logic of the game and the feelings of the other players so you can have fun killing things. You're not fixing the problem, you're becoming part of it.

It’s telling you think the only thing that can come from that situation is a TPK. Nobody’s ever made a threat to “straighten up or else”, as the most basic and uninspired alternative possibility.

i don't see the issue, in theory. if players have chosen to live by the sword, the dm is meeting them on their level by allowing them to die by the sword. and you never know, maybe it's an op party that could make it a close match. maybe the players had warnings and brought the god's wrath on their heads anyway. as with all things, there are contexts where it is appropriate and contexts where it is a wild overreaction. but this is a meme comm, not a nuance factory.

I am so sorry you had to endure that. I'm all for combat. And I do enjoy when my DM crafts a session with it in mind. But to just, hijack(shit all over) the story the DM has made just doesn't sit well with me.

The post is about putting people who always start a fight against someone unassuming, but undefeatable. What exactly do you think the DM in the meme is trying to do?

That is why it is necessary to be on the same page about the expectations for the group.

Agreed, but even with managed expectations it's a balancing act. Both from the players and the DM. Everyone is trying to get something out of their experience at the table, and it needs to have give and take. Murderhoboing just seems like the most selfish thing a player can do. It takes away from everyone else involved. You destroy plot hooks from other players, derail the story from the DM, sabotage combat for the combat players, outright deny roleplay for the RP players, and disregard a DMs crafting. I can even 'understand' spotlight hogs. But murderhobos seem to only get enjoyment from denying others.

I was GM'ing this game. The premise was that the goddesses created the world as this perfectly idyllic place -- an absolute utopia that I frequently compared to Mayberry RFD -- until the shit hit the fan. An ancient evil awakened and turned it into an absolute post-apocalyptic wasteland. Except for the single most populous city which the goddesses managed to shield from the corrupting influence of the ancient evil. (And a few fortunate pockets here and there who had escaped the corruption.) The PCs were the most murder-hobo of murder hobos. There was a town of halflings who continued their happy lives from before the calamity by day but turned into demons by night, not remembering anything come morning. The party marched them all (children included) into the schoolhouse, barricaded them in, and set fire to it. When they ran across a few dwarves who had retained their sanity, they robbed them blind. In the one city which was fully shielded from the ancient evil, they fireballed a procession of a dozen or so devout monks to take out one cultist hiding among them. That all just to name a *few* of their heinous crimes. Of course, in response to all of this, the central city put out arrest warrants on the party. They were going to be dragged into court and hung out to dry whether they liked it or not. I had a whole court scene planned. But it never happened. They sneaked into town, publicly executed the mayor and the sheriff, and installed the local crime boss as the new mayor.

I was GM'ing this game. The premise was that the goddesses created the world as this perfectly idyllic place -- an absolute utopia that I frequently compared to Mayberry RFD -- until the shit hit the fan. An ancient evil awakened and turned it into an absolute post-apocalyptic wasteland. Except for the single most populous city which the goddesses managed to shield from the corrupting influence of the ancient evil. (And a few fortunate pockets here and there who had escaped the corruption.) The PCs were the most murder-hobo of murder hobos. There was a town of halflings who continued their happy lives from before the calamity by day but turned into demons by night, not remembering anything come morning. The party marched them all (children included) into the schoolhouse, barricaded them in, and set fire to it. When they ran across a few dwarves who had retained their sanity, they robbed them blind. In the one city which was fully shielded from the ancient evil, they fireballed a procession of a dozen or so devout monks to take out one cultist hiding among them. That all just to name a *few* of their heinous crimes. Of course, in response to all of this, the central city put out arrest warrants on the party. They were going to be dragged into court and hung out to dry whether they liked it or not. I had a whole court scene planned. But it never happened. They sneaked into town, publicly executed the mayor and the sheriff, and installed the local crime boss as the new mayor.

I'm sure you don't need to be told, but for those who are reading and need to hear it: the most powerful and healthy thing a GM can do is say no. The GM gets to arbitrate the tone of the game and setting, and boundaries are healthy to both fun and creativity.

Putting a "random" encounter that didn't exist five minutes earlier in the path of your players, knowing it will be a TPK, is the DM version of murder hobo-ing. You're ignoring the logic of the game and the feelings of the other players so you can have fun killing things. You're not fixing the problem, you're becoming part of it.

"They hated him because he told them the truth"

Actually OP handled it pretty well, at least in the end . PC face consequences for their actions (a trial with the risk of being hung) and end up having to act to solve the problem. It's somehow created more game opportunities.

Was it fun for you to GM that game?

It's world of gods that intervene with mortals, so a GM is perfectly justified in-universe in smiting any players who get out of hand.

Putting a "random" encounter that didn't exist five minutes earlier in the path of your players, knowing it will be a TPK, is the DM version of murder hobo-ing. You're ignoring the logic of the game and the feelings of the other players so you can have fun killing things. You're not fixing the problem, you're becoming part of it.

It's called teaching a lesson. Murder hobos do not respect the game. By giving them this encounter, they will get down from their high horses learning that sometimes things are not what they look like and they should be more careful and smart about what they're doing.

That's not the lesson they'll learn. The problem is that they don't care about the game as a living story, but as a game they can win through violence. Using this encounter will just tell them that the DM can cheat to win. To quote the show Sharpe: "Flogging teaches a soldier only one lesson. How to turn his back."

The dm can cheat to win yes. That is also the lesson. Which means trying to beat the game is a hopeless goal. And if you think this is the game, you're gravely mistaken. The comparison to flogging is simply dumb. It's completely irrelevant. Now you can be a dumb player and refuse to learn anything from this encounter. It can spark a discussion then.