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Chebucto Regional Softball Club

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A forum for discussing and organizing recreational softball and baseball games and leagues in the greater Halifax area.

Skill checks

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  • ? Guest
    2 things: 1: I've gotten disco Elysium, and Ive only played a few minutes, but I don't remember it having rolls like that? How does one know what one is rolling? I played like 20 minutes of it 3 months ago, so maybe I'm misremembering. 2: that's how my brother DMs. I once critfailed a lock picking so badly that my character broke his finger. My brother laughed his ass off
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    wrote last edited by
    #59
    A lot of dialogue points and other actions will bring up a thing that rolls 2 D6s. Snake eyes is a critical failure, double sixes is critical success. The earliest point in the game where you can make one of these rolls is in your hotel room. Either by attempting to get your tie out of the ceiling fan, or by using the mirror and trying to stop making "The Expression." Many of them can be re-rolled later once you get more skill points. Others are one and done unless you reload or start a new game.
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    • ? Guest
      They do if the DM says they do, y'all get way too hard for the rules as written.
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      Guest
      wrote last edited by
      #60
      Not to mention which game you're actually playing.
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        Why the hell not? You're the DM. Why do you not have copies of your players character sheets?
        JackbyDevJ This user is from outside of this forum
        JackbyDevJ This user is from outside of this forum
        JackbyDev
        wrote last edited by
        #61
        I regularly play in groups with eight player characters, Kolkani. Do you want me to check all eight of their sheets and all their abilities that could possibly modify their scores or just ask them to make a Blah (Foo) check check and see what the result is? It's gonna be way faster for everyone to just ask them to roll.
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        • ? Guest
          This is also a great way to handle it; malicious compliance/monkey paw. Makes for some humorous moments. And yeah, if a player is constantly having to be told no, a talk may need to be had, and if it can't be resolved, they probably need to go. It's also a reason why Session 0's are so important; talking out what's expected of the campaign both on the part of the players and what the GM has in mind.
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          Guest
          wrote last edited by
          #62
          Having that 1 player being stalked by a horny dragon for the rest of the game, just in case.
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          • JackbyDevJ JackbyDev
            I regularly play in groups with eight player characters, Kolkani. Do you want me to check all eight of their sheets and all their abilities that could possibly modify their scores or just ask them to make a Blah (Foo) check check and see what the result is? It's gonna be way faster for everyone to just ask them to roll.
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            wrote last edited by
            #63
            How do you create fair encounters without knowing your player's character's stats? ๐Ÿคจ
            ? ? JackbyDevJ 3 Replies Last reply
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            • ? Guest
              You should at least have a general idea of your PC's skillsets. As in, don't let the country bumpkin make Arcana checks about monsters he's never seen, or let the stick figure try to punch down a wall. If you look at a character in a situation and think, "there's no way that could succeed," then they shouldn't be making a check.
              JackbyDevJ This user is from outside of this forum
              JackbyDevJ This user is from outside of this forum
              JackbyDev
              wrote last edited by
              #64
              Think of it from their point of view though. They want to try and do something. For me to just flat out tell them "no, there's no possible way" is discouraging and robs them of autonomy. Obviously for crazy extreme circumstances I won't let them, like "let me convince the king to abdicate to me!" type things. But if I think the DC should be 25 or something I'm not gonna bother wasting my time calculating what the theoretical maximum could be for the roll because I genuinely cannot know. The player can always do things I don't expect or use other players' things to help. For reasonable but implausible things I'll allow rolls even if a nat 20 wouldn't work because I'm not calculating what a nat 20 could theoretically be. Plus, I often give people little flavor benefits for nat 20s even if they don't have mechanical success.
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                How do you create fair encounters without knowing your player's character's stats? ๐Ÿคจ
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                Guest
                wrote last edited by
                #65
                Throwing whatever you please at them. It's fair because they're informed of the risks and given opportunities to adjust their plans.
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                • ? Guest
                  ![](https://sh.itjust.works/pictrs/image/f3295e71-046c-4070-b21e-d48b07433c89.jpeg)
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                  Guest
                  wrote last edited by
                  #66
                  20 peasants stand on the edge of the Grand Canyon and attempt to jump across. On average, should one succeed?
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                  • JackbyDevJ JackbyDev
                    Because I don't have everyone's modifier for every skill, ability, saving throw, and attack memorized off the top of my head, nor do I have magical foresight into whether or not they will choose to use abilities that would add more additional points on top of those modifiers.
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                    Guest
                    wrote last edited by
                    #67
                    In casual play you can rely on veteran players to know their stats. If they're the type to lie intentionally then they can leave the table. If they're making mistakes then maybe something goes a little too easily, oh well. The best DMs i had didn't give a shit and focused on rewarding players for learning.
                    JackbyDevJ 1 Reply Last reply
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                    • ? Guest
                      But at the same time, if the DC is so high that no roll could succeed, then they shouldnโ€™t be rolling for it in the first place
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                      wrote last edited by
                      #68
                      This. You only need dice if the odds are dicey.
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                      • B bartydecanter@lemmy.sdf.org
                        They absolutely do, and the bonus effects are listed in the description of each skill action. Oh. you mean in D&D. *washes hands*
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                        Guest
                        wrote last edited by
                        #69
                        Hello fellow Pathfinder!
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                        • ? Guest
                          (in D&D at least)
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                          Guest
                          wrote last edited by
                          #70
                          On page 242 of the Dungeon Master Guide 2014, it describes crit successes and fails as an optional rule. As optional as multiclassing and feats.
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                          • B bartydecanter@lemmy.sdf.org
                            They absolutely do, and the bonus effects are listed in the description of each skill action. Oh. you mean in D&D. *washes hands*
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                            Guest
                            wrote last edited by
                            #71
                            Dating back to 3rd critical skill checks in D&D suck because a lot of skills are written as pass/fail. Example: picking a lock. If we want to add criticals, a 1 breaks the lock; mostly okay, with the long acknowledged fringe problem of experts being incompetent 5% of the time. What does a natural 20 get? I adore opportunities to be creative, but thereโ€™s not a lot better than, โ€œYou did it perfectly.โ€ A regular success earns that according to the rules, I donโ€™t want to take it away. A speech about how cool and ninja the PC is can come off pretty cringey to me. The correct mechanical answer would be to let the 20 roll over to the next check because the PCโ€™s in the zone or whatever. Not awful, but it doesnโ€™t directly reward the player right when they rolled the 20, which is the occurrence weโ€™re trying to incentivize. Iโ€™m also rewriting several rules at this point. I personally donโ€™t mind pass/fail rolls in D&D or other games. Seeing the highest possible number on my die is inherently satisfying to me. Itโ€™s saving throws where a 20 or 1 really pulls at my heartstrings. 5e has critical saves as written and they work okay. Meanwhile, PF2e baked degrees of success into everything. On a crit fail they break the lock, on a fail they leave traces of their fruitless efforts, on a success they get one success toward opening the lock while scuffing it up a little, and on a crit success they get two successes and leave the lock looking pristine. The players donโ€™t feel cheated when they get a normal success and scuff up the lock. The 20 has some reward for most characters. The 1 has a setback, even a reasonable setback for an expert with a +25 trying to open the DC 10 lock on Grandmaโ€™s rickety shed. I really love it.
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                            • ? Guest
                              20 peasants stand on the edge of the Grand Canyon and attempt to jump across. On average, should one succeed?
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                              wrote last edited by
                              #72
                              While no individual peasant ought make it across, im pretty sure on average, one in twenty people can jump the Grand Canyon
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                                A lot of dialogue points and other actions will bring up a thing that rolls 2 D6s. Snake eyes is a critical failure, double sixes is critical success. The earliest point in the game where you can make one of these rolls is in your hotel room. Either by attempting to get your tie out of the ceiling fan, or by using the mirror and trying to stop making "The Expression." Many of them can be re-rolled later once you get more skill points. Others are one and done unless you reload or start a new game.
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                                Guest
                                wrote last edited by
                                #73
                                > Many of them can be re-rolled later once you get more skill points. It calls these white checks. Specifically they'll unlock again once you level up the skill or stat they're associated to. You can also find or buy dice that'll unlock some of them. > Others are one and done unless you reload or start a new game. It calls these _red_ checks. And they're often much more fun than white checks, _especially_ when you fail them.
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                                • ? Guest
                                  > Many of them can be re-rolled later once you get more skill points. It calls these white checks. Specifically they'll unlock again once you level up the skill or stat they're associated to. You can also find or buy dice that'll unlock some of them. > Others are one and done unless you reload or start a new game. It calls these _red_ checks. And they're often much more fun than white checks, _especially_ when you fail them.
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                                  wrote last edited by
                                  #74
                                  >You can also find or buy dice that'll unlock some of them. Those actually *do* something? ๐Ÿ˜ฎ
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                                  • ? Guest
                                    You should at least have a general idea of your PC's skillsets. As in, don't let the country bumpkin make Arcana checks about monsters he's never seen, or let the stick figure try to punch down a wall. If you look at a character in a situation and think, "there's no way that could succeed," then they shouldn't be making a check.
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                                    Guest
                                    wrote last edited by
                                    #75
                                    > don't let the country bumpkin make Arcana checks about monsters he's never seen Why not? It could be fun! Of course non-critical rolls would be useless, but on a critical failure they could convince the whole party that dragons can't see movement, and on a critical success they could buy mere chance figure out where its voonerables are (it's a million-to-one chance, but it might just work!)... > or let the stick figure try to punch down a wall Again, why not? _All_ rolls, they take a bit of damage; critical failure, they break their arm or hand, _and_ manage to dislodge a brick which starts a comically unlikely and _extremely_ noisy Rube Goldberg chain reaction which ends up waking up and alerting all the guards; critical success, they hit the hidden button that opens the secret door (in _another_ wall), starting a whole new subquest.
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                                      >You can also find or buy dice that'll unlock some of them. Those actually *do* something? ๐Ÿ˜ฎ
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                                      wrote last edited by
                                      #76
                                      They do! [Each one](https://discoelysium.fandom.com/wiki/Dice) reopens a different set of white checks, and reduces their difficulty! ๐Ÿ˜„
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                                        wrote last edited by
                                        #77
                                        Yep, those are all great responses. I learned a lot. Funwise, it seems like a good solution would be "failure... but!" approach. So the player have at least some reward for doing the best they can even if it's not enought to clear the chalange completely.
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                                        • ? Guest
                                          (in D&D at least)
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                                          wrote last edited by
                                          #78
                                          It has the same mouthfeel as a crit, I want my wildest dreams to come true every time I see that two zero
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